Bikes, Surfboards & Tents

[00:00:00] Chris: But I do remember asking, I met with a guy from Syria once, and I remember asking him, what he did for fun. And what were his hobbies, a thing. And it was, to me it was a very normal question to ask, but to him it was a very bizarre question. Because the majority of his life was survival.

[00:00:16] It wasn't fun. There was no time for fun. There was no opportunity to think about, ooh, what would I like to do today? It was, he had, shrapnel scars on the side of his face from extremist attacks on his hometown.

[00:00:29] Matt: This is the Relentless Pursuit podcast, where we hear stories from cross cultural workers on what it's really like to be a missionary. The good, the bad, and the ugly. So I think one of the things that we hear a lot about in missions, and even in just relentless pursuits, Sharing the gospel with people is the necessity of building relationships. It's important to build relationships with people before you share the gospel with them because that's the foundation that you do it on.

[00:00:55] But it's creepy. You don't just go up to somebody and say, I want to build a relationship with you. That is not how it works. And nobody's going to want to build a relationship with you when you come at it that directly. So the question is how do you do that? How do you build relationships with people so that you have an authentic.

[00:01:13] means of sharing the gospel with people in a way that is, is natural and organic and authentic. Today we're going to talk to a friend, Chris. He lives in the UK and he does build relationships with refugees, with people that are, that have come from other countries that do not have Christian background.

[00:01:31] And the way he does it is through shared interest, hobbies, bicycling, meditation, outdoors activities, surfing, and that is the platform. That's the way he builds relationships naturally. So I'm really looking forward to you hearing some of his stories from from working in the UK and befriending people and using that to build relationships and then also share the gospel.

[00:01:52] Chris: So my name is Chris originally from the East coast of the States. I've been serving in ministry here in the UK for just gone seven years. So going on eight years. So we started a team here. About five years ago, there was the initial couple of years I was here, I was working in partnership with the mobilization base here in the UK whilst exploring and developing a bit of a regional outreach to refugees and asylum seekers in the Southwest of the UK.

[00:02:22] And then that Developed and eventually materialized into, to the team that exists in this area now. Yeah, so like our team vision is to bridge the gap between the existing church community here and the unreached people groups coming to their very own doorstep. It's a bit of a two part ministry. We, obviously there's an outreach element to that engaging the nations here, befriending the nations here, discipling the nations here, but it's also equipping and training local church fellowships to do the same. And so to bridge the gap between those two communities, which that, that really came out of, Those first couple of years exploring what ministry looked like here and realizing that there are healthy, thriving, Jesus loving churches in our area.

[00:03:07] And there's also lots of refugees flocking to our area and people don't know how, within the church, don't know how to respond to that. They're, Oftentimes not very even comfortable, engaging with their British neighbors, let alone engaging with a, say, like a Syrian neighbor.

[00:03:23] And so we try to place ourselves in the middle of that and say, Hey, Syrian people can be friends as well. Here's a bit about their culture and their language and why they're here. And, as that understanding of, those, unreached peoples. comes to the mind of the church, I think God's heart for those people develops in the church as well.

[00:03:44] Jess: So when you were first planning on going to the UK and thinking about serving there, I guess you already had in your head refugees but this whole kind of vision of trying to bridge that gap, as you said, a couple of times, is that something that you already had like pretty clear in your head or were you just is that something that sort of developed over your time?

[00:04:01] Chris: Definitely something that developed. I think, I jokingly say that God only really ever allows me to see maybe one step out in front, maybe every once in a while, two steps, whereas I've got some friends who, God will tell them what's going to happen in a hundred years time. That's just not my case, the case with me and my walk with the Lord.

[00:04:22] So for me, I knew it was a, I had a real heart for the Muslim world and beginning my ministry in New York. My focus was refugees, asylum seekers, international students. And so coming here I knew it was going to be something in that same kind of area. But genuinely when I landed and got settled in a bit, I just asked God, I said, what in the world does ministry look like here?

[00:04:49] How do we even begin that? And God has a sense of humor. And so I was, I literally asked him for an open door and he brought me to a language school called Open Doors that, happened to be founded by believers who had real heart for the nations and a partnership relationship began there.

[00:05:08] And then, yeah, it eventually developed. As we got to know different church fellowships and as we got to engage with the nations, in our area. So definitely a developing process that eventually came to some level of clarity that has become, our team vision.

[00:05:21] Jess: But so that really involves cause we always talk about how there's a lot of, cross cultural work that happens amongst missionaries, but you're crossing like multiple different, cross cultural barriers all at the same time. Is that correct? That's what it feels like.

[00:05:36] Chris: Yeah, definitely.

[00:05:38] Jess: What would you say is like the most kind of like mind boggling out of all the different kind of cultures that you've had to try and figure out a little bit?

[00:05:45] Chris: Interestingly, I think the surprising one was just Learning British culture, learning how to function within British culture, because the assumption is, you come as an American, we share a common language that there's some funny word differences that you learn very quickly, words not to use and words to use.

[00:06:05] But yeah, with that assumption, you think, Oh, transition into British culture. will be smooth sailing. And the best way I can explain it to people is, if you stare at a computer screen, nine to five, everything on the screen is familiar, how to use it. But at the end of the day, you find yourself tired because it's all that, all the pixelation behind the screen that you can't see, but the human eye detects and it does wear on you and it exhausts you.

[00:06:31] And I felt as an American looking into British culture, that's what it was. It felt like it was everything looked familiar and I knew how to use it and I could communicate my way around. But at the end of the day, for quite some time, I found myself tired. And so I found that more difficult actually than engaging with, say, somebody from Syria, just because the expectation is they're obviously culturally and linguistically different.

[00:06:56] And so when you go into those relationships with that expectation, it doesn't hit you as hard. Whereas you go into British culture with the expectation, this is going to be similar, and it's not all of a sudden that hits differently. So yeah, it is very multifaceted, engaging with the nations, but also being like a foreigner in myself in this country.

[00:07:16] And what's funny, I think the engaging the nations here, what's really unique and quite a powerful tool is I'm here trying to learn how to live and thrive in British culture. And so are the refugees. And so we there's a common ground where we're like, Oh, we're all trying to learn how to live in this third culture together.

[00:07:38] And so there's a lot of laughs that are had as you make those friendships. And I think they really appreciate that. I'm not British, I'm also learning, alongside them. And I, though I have a British passport now I'll never, my experience in life is not a British one and same thing for them. They can eventually get.

[00:07:55] Jess: You also have a bit of a British accent.  

[00:07:57] Chris: Yeah, I suppose that happens after eight years, everybody around me sounds British. So yeah, you pick it up a little bit.

[00:08:06] Matt: Now, I know a lot of people, typically when you go to a country, whether that's in a European context, like you're in, or if they're in a developing world context, working with people that are local there, Muslims or Hindus or Buddhists, you're looking for a, an inroad or an opportunity.

[00:08:26] How are you going to build your ministry there? And so I'm wondering how you took that journey of discovering what it was going to be that was going to give you the relational inroads with the people that God had called you to reach and a way also of just being a real person in that new context.

[00:08:42] Chris: Yeah, sure. Yeah, so I think our inroads, like I mentioned earlier was this language, this international language school called Open Doors. They cater to teaching refugees and asylum seekers English, teaching them English. And so when I was in New York, I was involved in an English conversation group kind of network.

[00:09:02] And it was predominantly with international students, some of which were refugees and asylum seekers. I learned there that it's, Just learning the English language and engaging with them on in that platform is really powerful because it helps them to adjust and acclimate to a foreign culture because they can integrate better.

[00:09:20] They can begin to, communication is just a powerful tool. Obviously, they often get pushed to the fringes of society and isolated into their, own. Like pockets they're in little communities where they're familiar with the culture, familiar with the language, and they don't ever integrate properly and thrive in whatever their foreign culture is, whether it's in the States or whether it's here or another European country.

[00:09:43] And so the English conversation group network I was a part of in New York, obviously helped them to practice their speaking. English, but we also did like cultural acquisition events, Hey, let's go to this different event or let's go walk in the park or whatever. And having that experience and I just took it over to the UK.

[00:10:03] And when we, developed this relationship with the language school, we found out that they didn't have an English conversation group network. So we said, Hey, we'll, we have this experience from our time in New York. Perhaps we could voluntarily offer that here at this school. And they jumped on it. They were very excited about it.

[00:10:19] And so that's become our main point of engagement, our main platform for engaging. Obviously, it helps them that it's a safe space where they don't have to be afraid to make mistakes in their English speaking. We befriend them, good conversation is, happens there, so we do topics at the conversation group that kind of facilitate.

[00:10:38] Spiritual dialogue in a way, not explicitly, but it might be something about compassion. So we'll define what compassion is and say, in your culture, what does that look like? Or love, in your culture, what does that look like? And every once in a while you're prayerfully looking for those people of peace.

[00:10:53] Somebody says something and you're like, Ooh, I'd like to follow up with them. And yeah. All of a sudden, you're going out for a coffee or a lunch or you're being invited to their home. And, the engagement platform is in that conversation group, but the relationship, the friendship, grows from that.

[00:11:09] And then from there, we've done different things like, so my wife and I are really, being into like outdoors things, camping, hiking, cycling, surfing, et cetera. And so we'll take people who we befriend from the conversation group and say, Hey have you ever cycled before? Have you ever surfed before?

[00:11:26] Would you like to go camping? We provide all the equipment and they come along. And then the, the conversations that we get to have either on a bike or around a fire. But it's incredible, really good opportunities to, to talk very organically about who Jesus is and our testimonies and to hear, about their life story as well.

[00:11:43] Jess: So I'm sure that people that you're working with are from all over the world, but I have to admit when I think refugees in Europe, I don't picture them going surfing and cycling and camping and all these kinds of things. So I'm so curious when you. invite people to do that. Are they like familiar with those things?

[00:12:02] Do they, have they cycled before in their country of origin or gone camping? Or do you have to start them from zero? Or what's that bringing them on to doing those

[00:12:10] Chris: activities? Yeah, I think Some of the activities they would have done, many people especially in Africa, cycling is just something that it was a commuting thing for them.

[00:12:21] Surfing is very rare. Like it's very rare that you'll find somebody who's actively surfed in their home country. But I do remember asking, I met with a guy from Syria once and I remember asking him, what he did for fun and what were his hobbies a thing. And it was, To me, it was a very normal question to ask, but to him it was a very bizarre question because the majority of his life was survival.

[00:12:44] It wasn't fun. There was no time for fun. There was no opportunity to think about, ooh, what would I like to do today? It was, he had, shrapnel scars on the side of his face from extremist attacks on his hometown. And It felt, at that moment, it felt like a very Western thing to ask, because we're so used to having hobbies, whether it's art or outdoor activities or music or, whatever it might be.

[00:13:07] And for some of these people, that's never, that's not something that they've ever had the freedom to think about. And so initially I was a bit like maybe that's not a good question. But I've come to see that Now they're living in a place where they have the freedom to explore these. And those types of activities become really meaningful to them because they're like, oh wow you just want to get to know me as a person.

[00:13:27] You, and to have fun with somebody, to laugh with somebody is a really powerful thing. Even to use the person's name directly, say, Hey, like Ahmed let's go for a walk. He's known he's seen, and he's invited into a space where he can just enjoy company. And yeah, on the surface, doing these activities, might sound a bit petty but it's not at all because they're being valued and seen as the human beings with incredible value that God has given them.

[00:13:57] Yeah, so for some people they've cycled before, but for A lot of people the activities that we do, like surfing, camping, walking the coast path, like in the area that we live, are never things that they have never experienced, but I think they get here and they're like, Oh, now I can do these things.

[00:14:13] Of course, I'd like to go. So they usually quite keen, especially when we say, we have all the equipment, you don't need to bring anything. You don't need to pay for anything. Just come. And they love it. Yeah, it's been a really cool thing to. to be able to be a part of.

[00:14:25] Matt: Yeah, that's great. Because it's also something that it's not, you're not intentionally saying I want to disciple you or I want to share the gospel with you, but it's providing a very organic and authentic context to do those things in the context of a relationship or in the context of a friendship.

[00:14:41] And I think we often hear about the importance of building relationships with people that God is calling us to reach, but that's a very. conceptual idea of building relationships. How do you build relationships? How do you build relationships with anybody? By doing stuff that you hold in common, whether it's watching movies that you're interested in or talking about books that you're interested in or going hiking or going to going sightseeing.

[00:15:07] So it's a very specific and practical. example of what it means to build relationships, I think. Tell us a little bit more about the cycling aspect, because I know you've also started a ministry that you're calling Cycle for the Nations. Can you tell us a bit about how that began?

[00:15:24] Chris: Yeah. Do you want a bit of history? So yeah, cool. So cycling is, I feel like I should write a book. It's always one of my earliest memories in from childhood involved a bicycle. I had this tiny little Ninja Turtles bike and I remember sticking baseball cards like in, in the rear spokes to make it sound like a motorcycle. And I would draw these little speedometers and I would stick them to the handlebar.

[00:15:48] And then I got into BMXing, in my teens, that was a bit of an escape, me and my friends. doing dirt jumps and then in, fast forward in university, I I commuted to and from class. I lived a few miles, away from the university. I did bike cycling, like delivery, food delivery to, to pay the bills.

[00:16:07] Then when I moved to New York, I also commuted, I was part of The fixed gear cycling community, I was one of those guys, fixed gears. I was going to ask,

[00:16:16] Jess: I was like, I totally can see.

[00:16:17] Chris: Fixed gear, single speed, no brakes, don't need brakes. I was part of that community. My my wife and I our first date was on a bicycle.

[00:16:27] We, we rented a New York city bike and just for fun we only were able to get one of them. So she sat in the seat and I stood up in front of her and we cycled to Tiffany's not because we were going to buy a ring. We don't have that kind of income, but just to do something funny and weird. That was one of our first dates.

[00:16:43] And anyway, so long story short, cycling has just been a part of my life since I can remember, but it became very meaningful to me in 2013. So I started experiencing lots of weird physical symptoms. I had these things called like myoclonic jerks where my body would just randomly jump, and I I didn't have control over my limbs.

[00:17:06] I had like really terrible pressure in my head for like months, bad headaches, insomnia, panic attacks, like all the time, just really bizarre, like stuff that seemed very, unexplainable. So naturally I started going to the doctor and I had all these exams and annoyingly the exams kept coming back healthy which was frustrating because I didn't feel healthy, but everything was saying that I was healthy.

[00:17:31] And finally, after all the exams that they were capable of running, my doctor came in the room and said, You're healthy. There's nothing actually wrong with you. Tell me a bit about what's going on in your life. I shared with him, everything that was going on. I was working, I was beginning a journey with pioneers at that time.

[00:17:50] So I was, support raising or partnership developing. I was selling my house. I was working out in the gym four times a week. I was leading a life group at my local church. I was essentially, I was burning the candle from both ends and the middle. And he said, Oh, he said, you're a believer. And I said yeah, I'm a believer.

[00:18:07] And he said, Oh, I'm a believer too. And he said, can I, can I take my doctor hat off for a minute and just speak to you as a brother in Christ? And I said, yeah. And he said, let me ask you something. He said, do you keep the Sabbath? And I just laughed. I said, no, I said, I don't have time to rest.

[00:18:23] And he said, I'm going to diagnose you with something called general anxiety disorder, which I thought was something he had just made up. And apparently it's not it's a real thing. And he said you're struggling with anxiety. And he said, I could prescribe you medicine if you'd like, but as a brother in Christ, I don't know that's, That you want that to be your first sort of port of call.

[00:18:43] He said, so I'm going to just challenge you to go home and figure out what it looks like to Sabbath to rest. And yeah, so I went home and I began praying about that. And ultimately what that looked was getting on my bicycle, though. It's like a very moving activity, very dynamic activity.

[00:19:01] I found it to be the only space where I can actually be still. with God. So I would just cycle for hours and pray. And it became, just a healthy space for me mentally, emotionally, physically, spiritually. And it was about a nine month up to a year kind of journey, but ultimately God used cycling, a bicycle as the vehicle to bring freedom from this really terrible anxiety that I was experiencing.

[00:19:26] And so from that point, that was about a decade ago. just over a decade ago now. I've been free from anxiety. There have been moments anxious moments, but I've not struggled with anxiety in the sense of chronic panic attacks and stuff like that. So cycling is naturally just become very meaningful.

[00:19:44] It's still a Sabbath full place for me. And so more recently. I just thought God has used it in a powerful way in my life. Why not use it for the kingdom in some capacity? And so Cycle for the Nations was born out of that. So we started inviting refugees out on bike rides and It's just been yet another platform that facilitates good conversation about Jesus.

[00:20:08] So we will invite them on a cycle day out we'll rent bicycles for them again, so they don't have to bring anything. They just literally just have to come and we'll go for a nice bike ride and a picnic and a chat. And yeah, it's been really cool. Cool thing.

[00:20:22] Jess: That's awesome. Thank you so much for sharing that story. I love just thank the Lord for that doctor and for the way he used cycling in your life. And I think that's like such a cool example of like how Sabbath doesn't necessarily always look like maybe what we picture when we first say Sabbath, right? Like you picture someone like, like all alone in their prayer closet, or maybe like just at church, right?

[00:20:43] But, this is such like a clear example of how you really connected with, were refreshed by, or just so communed with the Lord through this very specific activity that wasn't necessarily just like you on your face in some like quiet place. And especially cause if you're living in New York and you're like cycling around New York city, it's really not what you would expect for something that would be.

[00:21:07] Chris: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's funny. I always say I'm still but moving. And so everything around me is moving. But you can't, you shouldn't, and can't really be distracted on a bike in New York City, because if you are, things might not go well for you. So you have to be quite focused, singularly focused, which is really good for your mind sometimes in a world.

[00:21:29] that pulls your mind in, hundreds of different directions all at the same time. So yeah, a good space for me. It's worked for me.

[00:21:36] Matt: So when you're biking in these groups, is it just you and local refugees or are there other believers? Cause I know one of your passions is to help local British believers see the opportunities to minister to the refugee communities that are coming into their country. So is this a way to mingle? These groups together that you want to bring together. Yeah,

[00:21:59] Chris: Definitely. Yeah. Like I said our team vision is to bridge that gap between the existing church and the refugees or unreached peoples on their doorstep. And it, it's an yet another opportunity to we've got like a small network of volunteers from local, various different local churches.

[00:22:15] And so it's really easy for them to engage with that as well. Cause it's, most of them have bicycles, so they just come along with their bikes and yeah, so It's usually a handful of us believers, which works really well when you're cycling because you can't all just stay in a line together, so if there's only one of us, not everybody gets to chat, but when there's, three or four volunteers who are believers as well on the bike ride itself, it works really well because everybody can buddy up and have a chat on the bike ride and get to know each other and, have a laugh and.

[00:22:44] Yeah. Socialize a bit. And then obviously during the picnic, then collectively we can all speak with one another. So yeah, it is. And it's minimal training required, for volunteers. It's very accessible for them just to we tell them, Hey, just live out loud for Jesus. Just be honest with yourself.

[00:23:01] Your story and your faith, we might give them a crash course one on one of here's some things maybe not to say or to not challenge people on, but in general just live out loud for Jesus, be organic. It should be an organic part of how we have conversation with people regardless of where people are from. So yeah it's usually a group of us.

[00:23:21] Matt: Any specific stories you can think of maybe things that you've heard from people or some of the kind of the spiritual encounters you've had with people that are maybe coming with openness toward the gospel?

[00:23:33] Chris: Yeah. So we, there was one guy from Morocco this is a bit of a spiritual story. Essentially he was like invited to be a part of something illegal in his home country that he didn't want to be a part of. And so he said no, but he said no to the wrong people. And so those, the wrong people blackmailed him and he wound up in a Moroccan prison for about two years. And so he's, I'm sat with him and we're talking and he's sharing this with me.

[00:24:04] And of course I'm asking him questions or what he went through and he stopped and he said, you know what? He said. They were the best two years of my life. And I was like, what? The best two years of your life? And he said, yeah, I just realized. He grew up as a Muslim, but he said he just realized that there was something bigger out there that he had always claimed to believe in but not truly believed in.

[00:24:26] And he said just the difficulties of those two years, he just realized there's something bigger out there. than me something bigger out there that's in control and is guiding my life. And he spent a lot of time contemplating this and praying through this, like during those two years and ultimately it was released.

[00:24:43] But it was prevented. He was blacklisted and prevented from functioning in society. And so he was left with no other alternative other to essentially either go back to prison. Or to escape. And so long story short, he journeys and escapes and gets to the UK claims asylum and kind of enters the asylum seeking system spent some time in London and got in contact with some other pioneers workers who began just sharing the gospel with him.

[00:25:10] And it was like. And God was like just surrounding him in his journey because left and center, if it wasn't a Pioneer's worker, it was another believer that stepped in and helped him in some capacity. And then the asylum seeking like process moved him down to our area and the Pioneer's workers that he had been in touch with got in touch with me.

[00:25:29] And that's how we made a connection and sat down and had a coffee in this chat. And he just kept saying Everywhere I went, he said, Christians helped me everywhere I went, like this person did this or this person did that. And so I had the opportunity to share the gospel with him and just said like God brings us places at the right time for the you know for the right reason because he desires us.

[00:25:49] He's pursuing us He loves us. He cherishes us and he wants us and I don't think that you coming here is a mistake I think this is all a part of your journey And it wasn't But a couple months later through a number of other conversations I got a text at two in the morning and he just texted, Chris, I've given my life to Jesus.

[00:26:08] And it was just like, what was so humbling is that it didn't feel like it was as a result of our engagement with him. It just, but we got to be a very tiny part in this man's journey. And God was just like relentlessly pursuing him. Sending one Christian after the next. Boom boom.

[00:26:24] It was like, yeah, he couldn't get away from Christians who just loved on him and shared with him. So that was really cool. So that's one story. Another story I'll share is through the conversation group. I tend to like an hour before the group I'll either go to a cafe or more recently, like I'll meet with our volunteers here in the van and we'll pray, just going into the conversation group for the topic of the day, for people that are going to be there.

[00:26:46] And for people of peace that the Lord might, have us have conversations with. And we prayed. I was by myself this day. I was at a cafe and I prayed and I just felt like God said be bold. It's just very general. Be bold. I was like, okay, cool. Be bold today. No problem. And I don't honestly, I don't remember what I said in the conversation group.

[00:27:04] That day, but I said something about my faith, something about Jesus. And it was like it hit, hit nobody. It seemed like nobody even bashed an eye at it. I thought, okay it was bold. Conversation group ended and everybody started clearing the room. And then this man from Iran. approached me after the group and he said, Hey, he said, Chris, do you have some free time?

[00:27:25] After, like now, like after the group to go for like a coffee. And I said, yeah, sure. Didn't say why. So we sit down for a coffee and he essentially just, Went on to tell me his testimony. He had already become a believer and he was looking for believers in our city. He and his wife were from Iran and they had gotten their hands on, his wife was an artist.

[00:27:49] And they were very fascinated, captivated by like religious artwork. So like the Last Supper, like famous paintings like this. And they started exploring who are these people and what is the story of this painting? And as a result, they somehow got their hands on a Bible in, in their language, in Farsi.

[00:28:08] And they said they read through it. They read the gospel of Luke and they said the first time they read it they were greatly offended. And the second time they read it, they were greatly convinced in his words. So they actually started hosting Bible studies in their like back garden in their backyard and they were found out.

[00:28:27] And so the government came and, shut down their business, closed their bank accounts. They got like threat letters, like in the post, in the mail. They were chased out of the country. He was sitting here telling me the story and he just looked me like square in the eyes. And he said, you know what, Chris?

[00:28:44] He said, we lost everything and Jesus is worth it. And here I am thinking I'm the one here supposed to tell you about Jesus, and I'm the one learning from you. Like, I've not sacrificed that much. He's, this guy has sacrificed his whole world. I learned so much more from him than I, I could have ever offered to share with him.

[00:29:05] And so we became good friends and we did Bible studies together. He He showed me one time the word magi in English translates in Farsi to a Persian word that is like essentially like a Zoroastrian priest. And so when it says that the magi or these Zoroastrian priests came from the East, he said, if there's a prophecy in Zoroastrianism of a coming Messiah.

[00:29:30] So he said, what's really interesting is he said, I believe that. Any Persian speaker who reads this in the Bible will be convinced that Jesus is the Messiah, because the Bible itself reveals that God was calling these Zoroastrian priests, these Persians, to see the fulfillment of a prophecy that they had in their own religion.

[00:29:52] And the prophecy is fulfilled in Jesus, the Messiah. He said that was part of our conversion was realizing that Jesus is that person. Jesus is the way. And he said, Persian speaking people, Farsi speaking people, they need to read the Bible. They need to see this. So really powerful stuff, God just moving.

[00:30:07] And there's a a Persian a small Persian community, church community in our city now that, that meet regularly as a result of stories like this.

[00:30:17] Matt: Yeah. That's great. It just shows it's not just people coming that aren't. of non Christian heritage. It's not just Muslims or Buddhists or Hindus that are coming as refugees, but often it's people that are of shared faith with us, and we're going to be able to learn from them and grow from them as well. That's really cool.

[00:30:37] Jess: I love in your stories also how there's like this clear bigger narrative of what the Lord is doing and you just get like a little bit of a slice of it but even as you get that slice that you get to be an active part of these people's lives he does give you a bigger picture look of Hey you're not the only one I use in this person's life.

[00:30:57] I used someone else here and someone else there. And, even just like the seat of that conversation for that guy in the Moroccan prison, like it reminds me of that verse. And I think it's Ecclesiastes where the Bible talks about God has put eternity in man's heart. And how that really came alive.

[00:31:12] during that time to bring him to the truth of the gospel, right? And how he's used you in these like small ways, used you and lots of other people in your life, whether it's pioneers, missionaries, or local, just everyday normal Christians to reach out and serve these people who've come here.

[00:31:27] Such, I love how you've woven together all those different pieces into these beautiful stories. So thank you so much for sharing those with us.

[00:31:34] Chris: It reminds me, it just reminds me of Daniel. Like Daniel, he doesn't go out looking for opportunities. He's just available. He's available for when God moves and he steps in to those moments with faithfulness and obedience.

[00:31:46] And God is glorified and the kingdom advances as a result. And so our encouragement to people is just be available for what God's doing. You don't, you rarely have to force the issue. To be fair for forcing, it usually doesn't go very well, but being present for the Lord and obedient to when, God creates his moments is really cool because you get to be a part of something God's doing. There's freedom in that. Yeah.

[00:32:08] Matt: Chris, thank you so much for sharing your story with us. Before we go, just one question we like to ask guests. Is there anything you've been reading lately or watching or listening to, any podcasts, any albums that have been encouraging and challenging you that you can share with our listeners?

[00:32:25] Chris: Yeah lately I've just been going back to the book of Acts, to be honest, and just being encouraged once again, and just how the Spirit moves. And like I just said, just being available and for the Lord when he moves and yeah, stepping into those moments with obedience, with faithfulness, with trust that, they're for good reason and God's in them.

[00:32:48] Yeah, I think that's just been really good for me lately, especially I'm actually about to step into sabbatical tomorrow. I'm having a, taking a short sabbatical it's been good for me to begin a journey through acts again, as I, take a step away and just spend a lot of time with God and then come back into ministry following sabbaticals.

[00:33:08] Matt: Awesome. Thank you.

[00:33:10] Jess: I think it's so easy for us to like. Chris mentioned, I'm don't have any training. I'm not a pastor. I don't, I'm not a natural gifted evangelist to just be able to randomly bring it up in any kind of conversation. And that's the true, honestly, of a lot of us. And so I just really appreciated how Chris shared about how, whether it's just through his normal daily life.

[00:33:36] just having coffee with people and how he's even been able to use some of the activities in his life that are passions of his and his wife's to naturally, like you mentioned at the beginning, Matt build those relationships, just make friends with people, hang out, have a good time. And then as you're doing that, you can, as Chris said, just live out loud with your love for Jesus with the grace and the truth for the gospel, just in normal everyday ways as you ask each other Oh, like what's compassion mean in your country?

[00:34:04] What's hospitality mean in your country? And those are just easy ways to bring up spiritual conversation. See if someone is open to talking about what they believe, what what is true for them or what's is important to them. And that is such a great way. To be able to share what's important to us and the life and hope that we have in Jesus Christ.

[00:34:25] And so I really just hope you all as listeners were able to glean some of those kinds of things as well that you can even apply to your own life today in the U. S.

[00:34:33] Matt: Absolutely. And Chris is not the only one in Pioneers who's doing this type of ministry. If you go to our show notes, you will see that we have a link there to A Canyon, A Cathedral, which is a video that tells the story of one of our workers.

[00:34:46] It's based here in the U. S. who takes international students into the wilderness to experience hiking and mountaineering and really getting out there and camping and uses that as an opportunity to share the gospel, to build relationships in a meaningful way. So be sure to check that out. Also, you may have noticed that Chris mentioned serving in New York City.

[00:35:06] He was part of New York City Immerse, a partnership that we have with the New York International Project, in which people that are on their way to the field go and spend over a year in New York City, experiencing what it's like to share the gospel among the many honoree sheeple groups that are living in New York City, in a context in which they can be mentored and guided. And have training. So we have links in our show notes to that.

[00:35:32] Jess: Thanks for following us on this episode of the Relentless Pursuit podcast. Our goal is to make missions accessible to show that it's not just reserved for elite super Christians. If you want to be involved, just go to pioneers. org slash start and answer a few questions. We have a team who would love to help you discern your calling and what your next steps might be.

[00:35:51] Matt: At Pioneers, we love to partner with local churches and send teams to people groups with little or no. Keep up with what God is doing by following us on Instagram, Facebook, X, and YouTube, all at PioneersUSA, one word, or visit pioneers. org. Thanks for listening.

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