From Facebook to IRL

[00:00:00] Drew: When Rashid gets in the car, we start driving and then my friend greeted him in his native language. And I've never seen somebody in my life just kind of shrink into the seat. And I was like, what happened? Like, I don't, I don't know what's going on. So he pulled up to my house and then he wipes the sweat from his face. And he says, I thought for sure you were taking me to the police.

[00:00:27] Matt: This is the Relentless Pursuit podcast, where we hear stories from cross cultural workers on what it's really like to be a missionary, the good, the bad, and the ugly.

[00:00:37] So because of globalization, often missionaries end up working with people groups that are not really the people groups you would expect in the countries in which they're serving. This could be mega cities that have different communities of people from outside the country. It could be international churches, which we'll hear about in our, in our interview today. Um, and it, and it just, It's amazing because of the way God is bringing people from all over the world into places where the gospel is being proclaimed. You never know who you're going to meet.

[00:01:09] Jess: And our guest today, that was definitely the case for a lot of his ministry, where it ended up being to not just like one or two people groups, but so many different people groups that he never really expected to work with when he first started. Decided to serve the Lord overseas. And so today we're going to drop into one specific story of how, during his time, uh, during Drew's time serving as a pastor at an international church, someone reached out about wanting to learn about how to become a Christian and how to follow Jesus. So let's dive right into that story today.

[00:01:44] Drew: So one night it was around 11, 11:30 at night. And my phone buzzes and it was a Facebook message. And I was like, I was like, Oh, that's weird. Uh, I don't usually get Facebook messages for one. And, um, yeah, and it was really late at night. So I click on it. And it was actually to the church's, uh, Facebook page that I manage, and that was, you know, our international church. And that was, you know, kind of our, what my primary role and task was in the city at the time was I was pastoring this church.

[00:02:17] And then this message came from an unknown name, you know, and it just said, I want to know to be Christian. And I looked at it for a second. I was like, huh? So I responded, you know, and I said, hi, you know, how are you? Then it began this dialogue with this, with this individual. And I asked a few more questions and they responded a few more times and then they just stopped responding. I was like, oh, that's bizarre. And then the next night around the same time, I get another message with a different name. And they kind of asked him this question again, and I responded and say, hi, it's me again. And I could tell it was the same person. And we kind of began this conversation and this discussion. And I said, would you like to meet with me? And about 15 minutes go by and there's no response. And then he says, yes, I would like to meet with you. So this guy responses, um, can you meet me in the industrial district in front of the main mosque in town? And I was like, Oh my gosh, that's probably like the, the like, scary part to me.

[00:03:28] Yeah. I was like, okay, well, um, you know, here I am this like Texan driving a white pickup truck. I was like, you'll be able to, you know, be able to spot me. And sure enough. I drive up to the mosque and there's this, this guy comes out from this, you know, war torn central Asian country, and he hops in and he says, you know, are, are you Drew? And I said, yeah. And so he, he says, hi, I'm, I'm Rashid. I said, okay. And so let's, let's go. And so we drive away to, um, an empty parking lot and we just started talking and, you know, we, we got, had some tea and we we're sitting there and we're chatting. And then he tells me about his story of. of coming to faith.

[00:04:12] And he had said that, you know, he had left his country four years earlier and he came as a, as a migrant worker and he was working and, you know, just kind of providing for himself. And he said, you know, I, I came from a, from a Muslim family, but I realized, you know, a lot of the challenges that I saw in my country were, were based on, um, Islam. And I, and I said, I'm not sure I really believe. So I left, but I didn't really know how to ask anybody questions about Jesus, because I never knew any Christians before, but when COVID happened, he was basically locked in his room all day long. You couldn't, he was a day laborer, so he wasn't allowed to go out and get work. And so you were just like stuck in his, it's essentially the thing of like a dorm room, you know, that he's sharing with six other, other men. And because he couldn't do anything, he spent his day on Facebook, just like chatting with random people around the world. And he began to like grow in confidence in English.

[00:05:10] And it was at this point that he says, you know, this thing that's been in my head for the last four years. is about following Jesus, and I don't know how to do that. And so I said, wow, that's, I mean, amazing. So I actually had an app on my phone where it was a discovery Bible study. It was called the Discover app and his English was pretty broken. You know, I'm doing him some favors with my recalling the story now, but we can listen to the Bible verses in his native language. And so we can listen to the Bible stories, and then we can look at the questions in his language that I didn't speak. And then we could talk about it in broken English. And it went really well for about, you know, two or three meetings.

[00:05:56] And then I said, Hey, Rashid, is it okay if I introduce you to one of my friends? And he said, yeah, yeah, that's okay. So the next time I picked up a, a friend of mine who was one of our church members who spoke Rashid's language, when Rashid gets in the car, we start driving. And then my friend greeted him in his native language. And I've never seen somebody in my life just kind of shrink into the seat. And I was like, what happened? Like, I don't, I don't know what's going on. So we pulled up to my house and then he wipes the sweat from his face. And he says, I thought for sure you were taking me to the police.

[00:06:37] Matt: Wow.

[00:06:39] Drew: And I was like, I was like, no, no, no, no, no. Like this, this is my good friend. And he can speak to your, to your heart in ways that I cannot. And it began this process of discipleship for this guy. And what was beautiful is, you know, three months later or so, maybe four months later, we got together and we got to have a, a baptism party and celebration for this guy.

[00:07:02] And you know, it was just a few of us there in the, in the side pool of somebody's house. And there was, you know, some singing and some dancing and we kind of did as best we could. And, you know, further down the line, this guy still loves Jesus very much. And there happened to be in our international church, one lady from his tribe who had come to faith years before. And, and they, they ended up meeting and falling in love and got married and still loving and pursuing Jesus now and trying to be a light among their people.

[00:07:38] Jess: That's so cool. I think that's like, so, because I feel like a lot of the people that he saw, the Christians that he saw, I don't know if it was, you know, there were like specific people or groups that he saw, but obviously those people have no idea.

[00:07:52] That they had an influence on this guy and that he would ultimately go on to become a faithful follower of Jesus, right? That's, that's sort of the kind of thing you only hear about after you get to heaven, right? But it's such a cool testimony of how people living out their faith. And really being, um, Jesus's aroma and his light, um, in the public sphere, how that really does make an influence, um, on other people's lives.

[00:08:17] So that's such a cool little bit of his testimony. Even, um, I'm curious cause he was afraid at that one point, right. That you're going to take him to the police. But I mean, you're in a Middle Eastern country, right? I mean, did that ever occur to you, especially with this like random kind of little bit sketchy guy, like messages you on Facebook?

[00:08:36] I wonder if that wasn't ever like a concern for you that maybe like this is someone trying to ferret me out.

[00:08:41] Drew: Yeah, certainly. You know, there, I would say there's a few different things that I had already experienced in my time overseas, which was. That a lot of people have responded to media, um, efforts that, you know, Pioneers media outreach and others had done.

[00:08:56] And those were always those really high intensity moments of saying, is this person a genuine seeker or is this person, you know, a government informant? Um, I had a really unique opportunity when I lived there because I was a pastor of an international church. And if you looked at my passport, you know, it said that I was a priest.

[00:09:20] In that country. So I was like, well, if there's somebody that needs to go meet with this person, it's me because I am a card carrying priest in this city. Yeah. So that this person reached out first. And so that, that gave me a lot of confidence that a lot of people don't have the luxury of, but I, I definitely felt like I can't, I can't spoil this opportunity.

[00:09:41] Matt: Yeah. Now Rashid came from another country. He was a migrant there as a worker. Would you have had the same access to people that were locals that were from that country? Or is it more dangerous for them to make connection with you and for you to be able to share the gospel with them?

[00:10:02] Drew: With the people in the country that I was living in? .

[00:10:04] Matt: Yeah. People that were native to that country. Cause I know sometimes what, you know, even just the fact that you were an international church pastor indicates that there was some allowances for people to practice their religion there as long as it was their own religion. But I'm sure there were restrictions around whether you could proselytize other people, Muslims and other people living there. So it was, is that kind of the situation with Rashid?

[00:10:28] Drew: Yeah, no, absolutely. There's a, maybe it's kind of an understanding. I don't know if we would say there, I mean, certainly there's a law that proselytizing is illegal. Of course, you could say this person, uh, per, you know, was the first one who's the initiator.

[00:10:42] Right. And so you're, you're free to speak, you know, of your own. Okay. If you're asked you're own religion Yeah. If you're asked. And so in that, in this sense, like. This person did, you know, ask, I think what's, what's more is beyond the, the legal concerns around the Middle East is that usually the struggles are not with the government as much as it is with the family and the tribes.

[00:11:07] And because Russia was. Apart from his family and tribe, he had that freedom to pursue, you know, what was on his heart, you know, as he, as he so desired, where most people, you know, they're interested, their families will still pull them back with a hold them back, or they won't allow them to do that. So it was his, his freedom of choice. That was really brought the opportunity.

[00:11:32] Jess: So going back to what you were saying about being a pastor, like your visa literally says priest. I think most people don't think of people, missionaries in the Middle East, having visa to become a priest. Is that like normal in your, in that region of the world? Or like, what kind of are the circumstances that you're able to. Become a pastor at a church in the Middle East.

[00:11:57] Drew: Yeah, there's, there's very few of these opportunities that exist. Um, they, they do exist, um, but there are, there are not many. And beyond that, some of the challenges are when people get those visas. They're very, very protective of it. And so they, they tend to be very cautious about what they're involved with and what they're interacting with.

[00:12:21] So they don't lose that opportunity. But for me, it was kind of a unique time, a situation where we, there's a few of us that came together and said, Hey, there was definitely a need in this one city. And this is actually a really fun story too. So we, we come to the city and we said, Hey, let's do it. We're looking to start a new church here.

[00:12:41] We feel like there's a need here. And they said, well, I don't know, you know, you should go talk to these people or go talk to those people. And we, we were basically in the, in the, uh, it's called the ministry of Islamic affairs and they were kind of the religious authorities. And so we said, okay. And so we're, we're kind of going through this process of trying to get this, this registered, you know, as far as our, our paperwork and other kinds of things with the religious authorities, we'd been a number of times and hadn't made any progress.

[00:13:11] And so one day we're sitting in this, you know, big office, the top floor of this government building and there's a guy sitting on the couch reading a newspaper and I started talking to him and he tells me his name and I recognize his tribe name from the town that I had lived in a different country.

[00:13:28] And I go, Oh, there was a lot of people, um, in this other town that, you know, with that same tribe. And he goes, that's where we're from. That's my tribe. That's, that's my, those are my people. And he's like, yeah, in. Whatever four generations ago, you know, my grandfather moved here and my family has lived here ever since I go, Oh, that's cool.

[00:13:48] Well, then he, he looks at the other guy. It goes, Hey, I like these guys go ahead and process their papers. And it turns out he was the big boss, but he was just like hanging out on the couch, reading the paper, drinking tea. And it was just like, so happens it's those kinds of chances where like the Lord just opened the door and we're able to get in and get the, uh, our church recognized and, and get visas through it. It was wild.

[00:14:09] Jess: Wild, like, what are the, there are like so many things in that whole story that are, what are the odds? You know, that's awesome.

[00:14:17] Matt: Yeah. Well, I think we often hear stories of how bureaucracy and kind of the relational complexity in countries like that can lead to doors being shut. But just as often, it sounds like there are ways in which they just strangely, doors are open for no reason other than being in the right place at the right time or having a relationship with somebody or some connection that was completely unexpected. Can you tell us a little bit about how you even ended up in this country?

[00:14:43] Drew: Yeah, my wife and I had, we'd spent seven years. In the Middle East in a different country with our, with our kids. And we had had open ed a couple of different small businesses and we were working with, um, the people that are local people that were there.

[00:15:01] And we, we praise God that we, we saw, you know, a little bit of fruit in our. Where we were at, you know, which was kind of a new thing, but eventually there was some government pressure that came upon us. And we like to say that we were, we weren't kicked out, but we were asked to move along. So it was the passive aggressive.

[00:15:21] It's time, it's time, it's time to go. So we saw the writing on the, on the, on the, on the wall and we said, okay, well, where did we go now? And we were, we were asking a bunch of questions about, you know, what, where do we use our, our language and our, our, you know, kind of a cultural knowledge and those types of things.

[00:15:38] And we were having lunch with some friends in a major city and they said, Hey, you know, we, we have this guy who's a church planning resident with us right now. You guys would be a great pair to work together. I had planted churches in the past. I'd spent years in the region. He says, this guy's new to the region. He's never planted a church before. Why don't you guys meet up? And so we met up and cause we were considering, Hey, is this the option, you know, or is it working with refugees in Europe? You know, there's lots of needs, lots of places, but, you know, we found it was, it was a great, it was a great, uh, connection. So we agreed to plant this church together. So we moved after seven years in the neighboring country, we moved across to this country and began a new international church there.

[00:16:23] Matt: Did that feel like a bit of a step down in terms of being kind of in the pioneering aspect of missions and now working a lot with Christians? So people that you're discipling and working with, um, is there a, Maybe a sense that there was a loss there.

[00:16:40] Drew: Absolutely. You know, we, we love to think of ourselves as like tough. We're going to pioneer to kind of find out the front edge of whatever it is we're trying to do. And then I was moving to a place where there was like a Starbucks, my neighborhood. And, you know, there was as many malls, you know, in that, in that town, as there wasn't an entire country I was moving from. It, it kind of felt like, man, What, what are we, what are we doing at this point? You know, are we kind of losing sight of what God has called us to? Because this place is great. I can order food on my phone and it comes to my house. And, you know, so that did feel, there was a sense when we first moved it of saying, are we, are we still following the Lord? Is this, is this still what we're supposed to be doing?

[00:17:24] Matt: We hear that a lot from people where it, they think that where God has placed them is going to be their long term destination, and then things happen completely out of their control, moving them somewhere else, and it can really be a sense of loss and grief, um, and wondering whether you can still be fruitful in this new place, and if the things that you've invested in in the past have been lost as well, and sometimes people hear stories from where they were at, where seeds that were sown there years before are sprouting in their absence. Did you have any stories like that?

[00:17:58] Drew: Yeah, absolutely. The, the, what was great was we were able to hand over the businesses we'd started to others. And a lot of the groundwork that we laid helped, you know, the, those stay and maintain their for. Years after us, and they actually saw more people come to faith in our city. When we first got to that country, there was zero, no, there was zero known believers in that town. And then when we left, you know, there was, you know, five or so adults. And then there was another couple, you know, two families, two couples that come to faith after us through some of the businesses that we had started. And so it was really neat to see things continue on. Even though we weren't present there with it,

[00:18:42] Jess: that's awesome. So as you're like making that transition, right. Moving to a new country, moving to kind of a brand new ministry, right. You weren't like pastoring a church in your first country and now you're like planting full on right with your priest visa, right. In your new country. I mean, how do you discern that? Like, yes, this, especially when there were some of these struggles of like, Oh my goodness, this is like so different from where we were before. Yeah. I think one of the questions that we get asked a lot is like, how do you discern the Lord's will? How do you know that this is really what he wants us to do? So how did you and your wife figure out that? Yes, this is, this is what the Lord wants for us in this season.

[00:19:19] Drew: Yeah. I think a couple of verses would stand out to me, which was like, like one is like kind of that. reminding ourselves that like, Oh, the God's word is like a, a light, uh, onto our feet and lamp into our path. You know, it was like, it's, it's just, what's the next step of faithfulness and kind of asking ourselves, what is that for us? And it felt like this was faithfulness for us was taking this next step.

[00:19:40] You know, I also was thinking about Romans 15 where, um, you know, Paul is writing about his desire to go to Spain and we're not a hundred percent sure if he made it to Spain or not. There's tradition that says maybe he did, but there's no real hard record that says he did. But after Romans, he was imprisoned. And then in that time, you know, he ended up writing the book of Ephesians and Philippians and Colossians. And I was like, man, he's like, has this heading and has this direction that he wants to go.

[00:20:13] And then in that time, like whether or not he made it there or not, like the Lord used him in incredible ways for writing these books of scripture that have blessed generations with people to coming to know who God is through them. And so it was kind of this reminder of things, man, even when the Lord gives us a heading and a lot of times. It's what happens along the way that he really uses for his glory.

[00:20:37] Matt: And to be willing to be redirected with the sense of expectation that wherever you are, God's going to make you useful for him. Um, because I think there is, you know, in the missions world, there's definitely a lot of perhaps even a sense of elitism in some quarters for how long people stay in one location.

[00:20:58] That's not always going to be able to happen, whether it's because of someone's family situation or just external circumstances in the country they're staying. So if their sense of fruitfulness is tied to that location and to their ability to be there, as long as they feel God wants them there, that can be really jarring and disappointing I think when you're disrupted in that.

[00:21:21] Drew: Yeah, absolutely. I think people see like unintentionally, they see their worth and their value. To the kingdom of God and how long they stayed in a certain place. And we have to untie ourselves from that and see us as beloved children of God, whether we're somewhere for six months or 60 years.

[00:21:38] Matt: And there's plenty of stories of people that have been immensely effective in a short amount of time that they've been allowed to stay in a place. And probably the inverse is this. It's true as well, you know, where people have been maybe outstayed their welcome because of that desire to stick it out and maybe haven't been receptive to those signals that it's time to leave.

[00:22:01] Drew: Yeah. That was always a challenge, right? Because when I was leading an area, I would tell our people, I was like, look, that our goal here is to plant churches. Our goal is not to retire here. And basically what I meant by that was, we're going to have to take some risks for the work that God has called us to. And we shouldn't see our, our mark of success by how long we were there. And so I think some people, it's like, man, they're just going to stay around for probably much longer than they needed to. Um, just cause that felt like that was the way or that was the goal. And, you know, certainly so much respect, so much appreciation for those that have, have spent. You know, 40, 50 years somewhere. Um, but also knowing that like, Hey, what are we being called to do right now?

[00:22:46] Jess: Yeah. I love that about like, just kind of like the faithful next step. Right. I feel like there's some like cheesy bumper sticker about like, it's not about the destination, it's about the journey or something like that. Right. But I mean, it's just such a reminder that. Yeah. God gives us that heading. He gives us that dream or that vision of the destination, but we're really called to be obedient to him and faithful to his calling and every little decision and every little step that comes along our way, getting there.

[00:23:15] Right. And not to mention the fact that I feel like oftentimes we think that the destination is this spot, but oftentimes it's actually something a little bit different. Right. So, um, I'm curious to hear a little bit, you know, as you land in your new country, you get this partnership, you're like, okay, I'm going to start this international church, right? Tell us a little bit, like, what were the logistics of starting a brand new church, um, in a country, especially one where you are actually allowed to start one.

[00:23:44] Drew: Yeah, that's, it's, it's funny because I, you know, was able to plant a church in the U. S. and, uh, and then here. So it was a really close comparison to be like, Oh yeah, we did this here and this there. Uh, what the, you know, some of the government regulations was, was just the continued seeking out of stamps. I always call it the, the stamp collector, uh, as becomes part of your job when, when you get started and making sure everybody's happy and making sure you get all your approvals. And so once that was done, man, our biggest challenge was just finding a place that would allow us to meet.

[00:24:22] So, you know, with, with a church plant in the, in the U S you know, you could find a school or find a community center and that didn't really work. And so we was just, we were trying to find a hotel that would. Would give us space and there's one hotel that was right in the middle of town. Like, Oh, this is location wise is great.

[00:24:41] They go, yeah, you can have it every week that we don't have a wedding. And we're like, well, how many weeks do you have weddings? We're like, Oh, we don't know, you know, like, but that week on Wednesday, we'll tell you if that weekend is good or not. Oh my gosh. And we're like, we're like, well, we need to know before Wednesday.

[00:24:59] Before we meet on a Friday morning, you know, and they're like, yeah, yeah, we'll tell you on that Wednesday. And so we're like, oh, okay, that's not going to work. And so what was really cool is we, uh, eventually did find a, a hotel that let us meet there. And we started meeting in that hotel and it was, it had its own challenges and issues.

[00:25:20] And then one of the ladies that worked at the hotel, um, left and then she called me and she called and she said, Hey, uh, Pastor Drew. Uh, I have a, I have a place for your church to meet. And I said, uh, okay. Uh, tell me about it. And she says, yeah, it's the, it's the convention center. And I was like the convention center, like, isn't that like owned by the royal family?

[00:25:45] And she goes, well, it's owned by a company that's owned by a company that's owned by the royal family. So it's totally fine. And I was like, Oh, okay. And she was like, yeah, I'll give you the same rates. You know, it's a bigger space is like theater style seating and like plenty of room for kids. And it was like, wow.

[00:26:03] Okay. And so we, it was a great place. We met there for, for years, you know, and it was just one of those things. You just met the right person who had the right connections and it, and it opened it up, you know, so that, so that was really great. And so, you know, I think the, the logistics. You know, are going to vary, you know, one place or another.

[00:26:22] The challenge is, is like, how do you have a public face with, you know, your, your faith and who you are and what you're doing in a city that is, you know, 90 plus percent Muslim. Um, and so that, that was the real challenge is just getting the word out. And so that was. A lot of just grassroots inviting people where we met them, you know, trying to think through like, man, where are there concentrations of people, you know, that would be Christian.

[00:26:51] And so you're naturally led to initially to, to people that are like from the, you know, maybe more affluent side of things that could, Oh yeah. Like the, the South Africans that might have a lot of Christians where they're, they're going to congregate at the, at the, uh, you know, at the rugby fields. And so you can meet a lot of them that way, but it's like, but how do you meet You know, some of the, some of the other folks, you know, some of the, some of the Africans and others that are, that are there that are probably not just hanging out with their friends, you know, in a social setting.

[00:27:20] And so that took a little more work and a little more effort. And part of that was just kind of establishing an online presence. And once we established an online presence and people could find us by Google, you know, or by Facebook or other things that really helped us to make those initial connections to continue to, to expand out and, and kind of, gather and bring a core of people to the church.

[00:27:40] Jess: Yeah. I mean, that was like how Rashid found your church, right? It was through Facebook. So, I mean, did you have a lot of people that messaged you through that and were like, Hey, I'm looking to become a Christian or I'm looking for a church and had found your church that way?

[00:27:54] Drew: There was not a lot of people that found the church that way, but there was definitely some really significant ones. So that, which was, which was great. You know, there, we, some of them are just the people that were people that kind of opened a doorway for a bunch of others, you know, to find us. Like we found that we would You know, have somebody from an African country reach out and then we'd help them get there. And then the next thing you know, they tell all the people that they know that are also would love to have a church to go and worship at start showing up together. And so it was like, you, you, one person would lead to 20. It seemed like every time.

[00:28:32] Matt: Hmm. So what were some of the nationalities of people that were coming to the church?

[00:28:38] Drew: We had, we had Egyptians, we had Pakistanis, we had Indians, we had Filipinos, we had, you know, Americans and Brits and Germans. Um, we had, you get to baptize a Cuban guy one time, which was really fun. Um, Sweden, you know, there was. Maybe 10 or so different African countries, you know, that were, that were present. And so what was one thing that was really, really interesting was that where we were located, we didn't baptize anybody from the country we were at or the countries right around us, but like the next ring out of like Sudan, Egypt, Lebanon, you know, Pakistan, India, like we're able to baptize people from those countries, which was really cool. It was like, just, it was just like how to go one ring out was just far enough for people to feel like they had that freedom of, of seeking Christ when people were coming from, you know, various backgrounds when they, when they came to faith. So that was, that was a neat, that was kind of a neat deal.

[00:29:38] Jess: Yeah. That's so fascinating to think that kind of idea of just sort of like one additional ring out that it's almost, I feel like you could like build a strategy for church planting and evangelism based on that kind of idea. Yeah.

[00:29:54] Drew: Yeah. It's like, uh, the strategy is like, don't love your neighbors, but love your neighbors, neighbors.

[00:29:58] Matt: Well, and I love it that it, we see this a lot nowadays where God is taking people out of their countries of origin and placing them in parts of the world that in this situation, it's not like it's more open. It's just that it's different from where they were. And that allows them to be more receptive to spiritual things, um, outside of their maybe comfort zone or outside of places where their family might be resisting their exploration of these things.

[00:30:27] And I always come back to act 17, you know, this idea that, God places people where they're at in the world so that they might seek after him and find him. And we're seeing so much of that nowadays as people migrate and intermingle in these different cultures outside of their home culture. It's easy to overlook the spiritual dynamic and how it's affecting the global church. Um, so it's, I just love these stories because to me it's very similar to what we see in Acts 17.

[00:31:00] Drew: No, absolutely. I think that's a, such a unique, you know, um, way that the Lord works and has historically worked. You know, it's not, it's not this new thing that we're just discovering. Right. But that like, we look at the history of the church and the spread of the church and like, man, it was just really unique ways the Lord has used to draw people from maybe outside of their, you know, country of origin, you know, to hear truth.

[00:31:23] I mean, acts two would be another, you know, good example of that, but I think one of the, one of the fun things is we used to do it at our. At our international churches, we would pray for unreached people every time we'd gather, and we would just choose different group. And then like one day we were praying for a group from, um, Northern Nigeria.

[00:31:43] And this guy comes up and goes, that's my people. That's my tribe. Wow. And I was like, wow, that's incredible. I'm so glad that we just got to pray for your tribe. And he's like, yeah. And he told me his story of how he came to faith himself. And so some of those kinds of things you're like, I didn't even know there was people from this people group that were here. Yeah. And. Now believing, you know, this is really, really neat.

[00:32:03] Matt: So drew, as we're winding down here, is there anything that you've been reading or listening to, or watching that's been challenging you? It could be a movie, a podcast, a book, anything like that, that you want to share with our listeners.

[00:32:18] Drew: I think this is where on a Christian podcast, you're supposed to talk about watching the Matrix, but, um, I actually got a, I got a different, different book recently, um, which is, uh, Pipeline: Engaging the Church in Missionary Mobilization. It's by, uh, David, and Lauren Wilson. It's so. I, I love it because you know, it really highlights the church and the church's role in, in raising up people for the nations. And so I'm, I'm very passionate about the local church and wanting to see the local church grow and, and it's, and it's strengthened and to fulfill its role in, you know, in glorifying God among the unreached. So it's, it's a little bit nerdy of a, of a church book and a missions book, but man, it's, it's been really good. I've really enjoyed it.

[00:33:04] Matt: What a great conversation with Drew. Um, I, I want to make sure that everybody knows because we didn't really introduce Drew at the beginning of the podcast, but Drew is our VP of church partnerships here at Pioneers.

[00:33:16] And Pioneers places a really high value on our relationship with local churches, both for sending, for supporting, for partnering on the field in ministry, whether it's here in the US or whether it's around the world. So be sure to check out our show notes because we will have a link. to our Church Partnerships team webpage on Pioneers.org.org as well as some other resources that um, our Church Partnerships team offers to both churches and to people who are considering going to the field as missionaries.

[00:33:45] Also want to mention Items May Have Shifted, a book that Pioneers published last year which has four stories similar to Drew's story of having to leave a country unexpectedly and how God brought, uh, couples and families into new areas of fruitfulness in new countries where they may not have even have expected to be when they first set out.

[00:34:05] And then also I want to have some links in our show notes for media outreach. Pioneers Media Outreach is an important part of Pioneers Ministry that uses Facebook, social media marketing, and the internet to find spiritual seekers much like the one that reached out to Drew when he was pastoring in the Middle East.

[00:34:24] And then one more thing, Don't miss out on the bonus story we have where Drew tells us a story about what happens when a group of Muslims and a group of Christians have a friendly soccer match. And you're not going to believe what the trophy is that was offered to the winner and how that all turned out.

[00:34:42] But I'm not going to tell you in this, um, podcast, you're going to have to check out our show notes and follow the link. To the bonus story.

[00:34:50] Jess: Thanks for following us on this episode of the Relentless Pursuit podcast. Our goal is to make missions accessible, to show that it's not just reserved for elite super Christians. If you want to be involved, just go to pioneers. org slash start and answer a few questions. We have a team who would love to help you discern your calling and what your next steps might be.

[00:35:09] Matt: At Pioneers, we love to partner with local churches and send teams to people groups with little or no access to the gospel, keep up with what God is doing by following us on Instagram.

[00:35:19] Facebook X and YouTube all at pioneers usa one word or visit pioneers.org. Thanks for listening

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